Comments on: Creation or Evolution? The Kaleidoscope.

By: ZBalance

ZBalance — Fri, 13 Jan 2006 00:21:56 +0000

Hear! hear! It’s time for the feats of strength!

By: archangel

archangel — Thu, 12 Jan 2006 22:01:40 +0000

And what about Festivus? Let us all gather ’round the Festivus pole!

By: bladerunner

bladerunner — Wed, 11 Jan 2006 23:03:11 +0000

Well, you’ve got me there. We started doing Easter baskets right about the time my first child was born. And then you cannot stop. It is a very strong “holiday” meme. I used to disdain Christmas trees and Christmas lights, but after I got married I was first forced to buy, then eventually came to love the silly things.

I think the best kind of faith would be that experienced by a castaway on a deserted island, with no hope of rescue. No distractions, no adulteration, just pure faith. But then you’d also go insane…..The Bible says you should surround yourself with good, like-minded Christians, probably because the flesh is weak. But there can also occur great relationships between friends, that just happen to both be Christians…

By: ZBalance

ZBalance — Wed, 11 Jan 2006 21:44:48 +0000

Ahem. Christmas. Cough cough.
Oops, did that slip out?

Easter is about the basket, man.
Thanks to my wife, even I get a basket on Easter. Don’t you?

And let’s face it, although I believe the Jewish holiday came first, Hannikuh (I’m not even going to look that spelling up) and Kwanzaa wouldn’t even be on the map if they didn’t occur near Christmas.
Leach holiday’s.
Ask the common American to name any other Jewish or African holiday and the month that they occur.

By: bladerunner

bladerunner — Wed, 11 Jan 2006 05:15:36 +0000

I must say, the Hebrew celebrations are the best. You cannot compare a good Jewish wedding to a Christian one. * I * really want to ride around in a chair hoisted by all of my friends, and try to touch my new wife on her chair; that’s excitement!!! And Easter dinner in America is one of the most boring celebrations around. Finding Easter Eggs is too pagan for me. But my daughter comments: “Hey, it’s fun! What about the Easter Bunny, Huh?????? HUH!?!?!?!? LOL. Well, I think it’s a nice tradition to have….sorta. Hey, it’s fun for the little kids! And, it’s ALL ABOUT THEM. THEM HAVING FUN. RIGHT? *WINK* *WINK*”

By: archangel

archangel — Mon, 09 Jan 2006 23:28:33 +0000

When you mentioned the Messianic Jews, I recall the time I was out with Beth (who was getting more and more into Judaism) when we saw a group of “Jews for Jesus”. She was completely indignant about it, and said, “You know what we call those people? Christians!” I had never heard the word Christian used so disdainfully. In retrospect, it was quite comical, as she was really quite insecure.

By: bladerunner

bladerunner — Sun, 08 Jan 2006 15:52:57 +0000

Yeah, you’ve hit the toughest of spots for me: conversion out of Christianity. Although I’m cool with non-believers (you’ve renounced all beliefs) I still get tough on people who convert out of Christianity. Perhaps because the rejection is so overt and it is documented, as opposed to those that just let their faith fade away with time. I recall the story about a young woman that converted to Judaism; there was a spot in the ceremony when she was asked to renounce Jesus and his teachings (this is perfectly valid, as an Orthodox Jew you must renounce heretics like Jesus). The woman remained silent and the rabbi mercifully and awkwardly moved forward with the ceremony.
In that case, I’m with the Messianic Jewish people. They are Jews but believe that Jesus was the Messiah. So their faith and Christianity is in alignment. “Conversion” is just a matter of which holidays you observe.
I’m pretty harsh on Elizabeth Taylor. She converted to Judaism because she liked their religious celebrations better than the Christian ones. This seems to me to be very superficial. I personally would still be a Christian even in you removed the great holidays, say Christmas. The trappings of “Religion” have nothing to do with your faith. If you’re in it for the social benefits, I support Zbalance’s stance and stay away from the whole mess. But if you’re looking for answers to the BIG questions “Why am I here” and “Why is there suffering” and “Am I loved” then God is your answer.
As to the other question, in my opinion mixed-belief marriages can be dangerous. I’ve seen many of them succeed, but only because one party subsumes their beliefs for the other person’s sake. And when the kids arrive, it gets really hard. I’m very shallow and would not marry a smoker, no matter how nice and attractive the other person was, so you see where my equation results in an inequality. In my view (for another post) Love can be found in millions of perfectly compatible mates. All of them have the potential to be your ‘soul mate’ as long as you put the time into the relationship. So pick one that shares your religious views; it’s so much easier and reduces the pain.

By: Hulagun

Hulagun — Tue, 03 Jan 2006 22:04:37 +0000

I’m glad to read a lot of the views here, especially the idea of a hybrid of both faith and science. I hesitated to use religion out of habit, but I think faith is more accurate.

Religion really does feel like a club and to me, it seems too culturally-defined to ever be universal. I think there are universal themes, beliefs, and morals within every religion that all cultures and walks-of-life may consent to. But for me, the sheer fact that we actually have a selection of religions to choose from (and that this day in age, it is much easier to change faiths) only says that they can all be, both, correct and incorrect.

Religion is correct because they DO have a universal concept in mind: Someone or something created the world we live in. At least I believe that. It’s too fantastic a place to be the result of pure evolution. There had to have been a starting point after there was nothing. It’s easy, in perspective, for science to figure out the language in which the universe evolves but it is left in the hands of faith to explain how it began.

Religion is incorrect because it is easily clouded by culture and law. What should be higher in the scope of life becomes victim to the changing of times. PC movements, changes in law, social adaptations… all effect how we subscribe and follow religion. For something that should be dangling us all by strings, it’s too easily shook up by what’s hanging from it.

To add to ZBalance’s thoughts, how about the Christian who converts to Judaism to save the marriage and please the fiance’s faith and family? One person leaves a faith to take on another simply for the love of an individual (And it’s not God). But on the other end, the Jews are gaining a new recruit, so to speak, and possibly conflicting their own beliefs. Taking in an impure individual and cleansing him so he may be born again. The sanctity of an entire religion is bent on the hierarchy of love.

Love and Hate may be the only two real things that we can all believe in.

By: ZBalance

ZBalance — Tue, 03 Jan 2006 12:12:46 +0000

You got me on the “belief” quote but I wasn’t trying to say it was faulty to use the term. I just hate the sound of it.

I appreciate everyone being able to talk civilized about such a subject when most of the world would be at war by now.
Especially when there is no way of proving who’s viewpoint is the most accurate until the end.

If however I am proven wrong,
and the gates to heaven are closed to me,
be aware that if you guys shout “I told you so.”
I will be giving you the finger on the way down.

This sounds like song lyrics.
If I could only make it rhyme.

By: archangel

archangel — Tue, 03 Jan 2006 01:25:38 +0000

Zbalance, I humbly point out that you were the first to say you held “beliefs”. I was merely following your lead. And yes, the word does connotate faith, or presumption, a conclusion based on the facts you know. It works both ways, therefore it’s used extensively in both the worlds of science and religion. The Big Bang – many believe in that theory (I lean towards it myself), but it remains a theory instead of a law because we don’t have the means to prove it. Just as we don’t have the means to prove – or disprove – the existence of God. It is all belief based on “fact”. Because of the nature of God, no fact can ever disprove His existence.

I will take it one step further and say that we we often call facts are actually observations, and/or the conclusions we come to based on these observations. We call them facts becase it greatly eases communication; most of us are in agreement on them. It’s only when we disagree we start to question other’s observations. Or our own. Not all scientists believe in the Big Bang theory. Not all Christians believe in Creationism. The same goes for miracles; there have been many miracles observed throughout time. Many cannot be explained by science. But this does not stop some from having *faith* that science will eventually explain all things. Due to my experiences and observations, I do not believe that science will answer all. But I can understand how others would make that leap of faith, just as I am making one.

For the record, I believe in evolution. I was taught by my priest that it didn’t really matter how you believe the universe was created, the important part is that you credit God. And that I do, while also agreeing with the conclusions scientists have made based on their observations of fossils.